Trying w10 on my old PC

[Telstar]

Hi Peter and everyone,

I just got back listening to music after moving to a new house, and I fired up my old dedicated PC, which now is pretty old (see signature) but works like new since the OS has run always offline. It has w7 home 32bit (the cpu is not 64bit unfortunately) 4GB of ram and the original optimizations. Xxhe 0.9-4.1 sounds BETTER than the newer versions probably because the CPU isn't much powerful.
I have just upgraded the USB interface of my DAC with the singxer f1 which is isolated (limited to 384k but oh well.). At the moment I cannot afford other upgrades since I have still to do more renovations.

But I want to try windows10 since I have a spare 128GB SSD removed from my work PC... which build should I put on? I would shoot for the creator's update like I use on my work PC (build 16299) but nobody seems to use it yet.
It will be offline for now, so no issue with updates and such. and I do have a license for a Home edition.
I can download any iso and hopefully a usb installation will work.

Other random questions:
1) which is this Silverstone usb card I read in some posts? My pc doesnt have a lineas psu yet, but the DAC usb is isolated: should I get one? Or another pci-e usb card maybe.

2) I'm gonna roll some usb cables and I'm also building one without 5V and a special ground setting, which I will share if it works.

3) I want to use my android tablet as remote/screen/controller for it, MS RPC is the best app available? and also it requires the PC to be connected to my LAN? I have an ethernet port close to it for this eventuality. No wifi onboard but a card could be added if better.

Also, I will be upgrading it with a manycore 64 bit cpu later this year. What are your thoughts about AMD epyc (32 cores)? I do need a mATX or even better ITX motherboard to save space inside the case (which I'm NOT changing).

[PeterSt]

So Telstar, that is a lot of questions. Let's see;

First off, XXHighEnd still runs under the 32bits OS. However, some feautures may not work because too complicated to make twice. IIRC, preventing the system from automatically upgrading is one of them. There could be more. All I do is fire up XXHighEnd on a 32 bits (W7) machine - and don't use it for playback.

But I want to try windows10

If your CPU really supports 32 bits only, then you are in bad luck. W10 only comes in 64bits versions (although I recall that at very first it was (could be) also 32 bits - like the Consumer Preview).

and I do have a license for a Home edition.

I want to use my android tablet as remote/screen/controller for it, MS RPC is the best app available?

Bad luck again, because RDC is not suported on Home. OK, only 3 weeks back I managed to tweak a Home OS to accept it after all.
Anyway, yes, I think we all will agree about MS RD program which is available for Windows itself, OSX, IOS and Android.

and also it requires the PC to be connected to my LAN?

Yes. But Internet can be avoided.

the creator's update like I use on my work PC (build 16299)

See the other topic you posted in, and my response about it.

I can download any iso and hopefully a usb installation will work.

They all do. But if your cpu is 32 bits only, they all won't.

which is this Silverstone usb card I read in some posts? My pc doesnt have a lineas psu yet, but the DAC usb is isolated: should I get one?

Let's say that this is outdated, definitely per W10 14393.0. But, not by 100% guarantee because most who actively used and reported, use the NOS1 DAC. Today I think we all use the USB3 port and this too is dangerous to advise because now again many use the same mobo (like ASRock X79 or X99M uATX).

Notice that you will need (from the top of my head) XXHighEnd 2.01 for W10 suport. And depending on the W10 Build, later versions (but of course using the current 2.09 does the job).

Also, I will be upgrading it with a manycore 64 bit cpu later this year. What are your thoughts about AMD epyc (32 cores)?

Maybe you know that we supply an audio-dedicated PC (Stealth Mach II LPS). It can very well be that this ends up in there, when the current X99M runs EOL. But, chances are I think higher that it won't happen, because that processor is not "cold". But I suppose I will try anyway. Notice that this is all in the context of 40 core Xeons (hyperthreded) which also run in that PC without overheating. And the "standard" 20 core is cheaper - at least the last time I looked.
Summarised, I will try it, but don't give it a big chance.

I do need a mATX or even better ITX motherboard to save space inside the case (which I'm NOT changing).

Unless things will be changed (or already have been), ITX is NOT good. This is for reasons of the power supply and how it is implemented and the parallel memory leans (two instead of four). uATX is fine, as long as a decent MoBo exists, and this historically not has always been the case (but wait a year and it's back again for the latest chipset etc).


Peter

[Telstar]

Hi Peter,

TYVM for the reply.

Looks like I was wrong! and my CPU is 64 bit:
https://ark.intel.com/products/35300/Intel-Pentium-Processor-E5300-2M-Cache-2_60-GHz-800-MHz-FSB
I dont know why I thought it wasn't. The low frequency I think helps with the overall good sound I was always getting from this machine.

Anyway, last night I went ahead and got the 32bit image of build 14393, and installed offline from usb (too old mainboards do not support that, but gladly mine does). My concern was lack of driver. Instead, everything works. I just had to fiddle to manually install intel gfx.

Note: W10 has indeed 32 bit versions but 2016 server (which I also wanted to try has not).

I have to verify about RDC because I would prefer to not buy another license. This is the first thing I have to do before getting a new image 64bit and install it. ha
Second thing is to verify if xxhigend 2.09 isn't too much a resource hog for this computer.

I do not have a usb3 port on this mainboard, so I think I will get a pci-e usb3 card: is any chipset preferred (Renesas or? Intel afaik doesn't make second market usb cards)

I downloaded the latest xxhe version 2.09 and plan to go straight with it. I think I will have to pm or mail you for activation code, as I have read.

Thanks also for the heads up about future mainboards and processors. 40 cores xeons are way too expensive for what they offers wrt 24 cores ones IMO.
I'm aware of the Stealth PC you offer but I prefer to build things myself, and keep my case, but if possible I may want to buy the mainboard and LPS from you. Looking at the inside pictures it shoudl fit. We will talk about this later this year.

[Telstar]

Looks like i got the right image now (and a bigger usb key for the install).
Pro will be, no headaches from getting RDC to work and easier to stop updates (this may regard how xxhe handles that too).

[PeterSt]

Looking good ...

[Telstar]

(I'm posting this here instead of opening a new topic, hope it's ok)
I haven't had the time to redo the w10 install with the 64bit one and do optimizations on it yet, but...

Googling around I found out that my mainboard (which I like very much, have I said that? ) supports newer cpus up to 4C/8T core duo or xeons, also with 12MB total cache. Same TDP or a bit higher that should be fine once downclocked.
Would such an upgrade be worth? Note that prices of these old cpu are around 50€ so it's quite trivial.

Does xxhe uses threads or only cores matter? Still, going from 2 to 4 is a noticeable benefit or I just save my time and wait to replace all with a 20+ core cpu later?

[PeterSt]

Does xxhe uses threads or only cores matter?

Telstar - both and all over.
The more cores the better the sound will be.
For 50 euros I would give it a go as long as the real $ stays out somewhat.

Go for it ...
Peter

[Telstar]

Thanks. I think I will, as I have found a 65W part for 55$.

I do remember that going from dual to quad core was a big improvement for normal usage/multitasking. I can only guess it will be the same for music playback.
The additional cache may help it too.

[Telstar]

W10 (re)installation, optimization went smooth, and also xxhe 2.09 (which required the cr*ppy .net 3.5).

Next thing is the usb3 card. Then I can start listening.

[PeterSt]

Well done !

Next thing is the usb3 card. Then I can start listening.

Don't be disappointed when it appeard you are in demo mode. Because of course you are now. Being activated not only allows Minimized OS but also the Processor Core Appointment, which could be crucial for you. And what is new for you, are the Q3,4,5 settings which when all set to 1, imply the best possible SQ (methinks), but this can only work in Minimized OS (normal OS is too slow for this) plus when low on processor core count it is a bit of a search which Core Appointment Setting does the job.

If you can't control the system anywhere any more (no mouse moving or anything) BUT the sound keeps on happily playing (until the end of the playlist ) you'll know you arrived at the wrong setting.
Haha. Chance that this happens is not big, but it does exist.

Regards,
Peter

[Telstar]

Don't be disappointed when it appeard you are in demo mode. Because of course you are now. Being activated not only allows Minimized OS but also the Processor Core Appointment, which could be crucial for you.

Oh, yes, what do I need to send you for activation? Can we do it offline?

And what is new for you, are the Q3,4,5 settings which when all set to 1, imply the best possible SQ (methinks), but this can only work in Minimized OS (normal OS is too slow for this) plus when low on processor core count it is a bit of a search which Core Appointment Setting does the job.

I'll experiment with everything in time. I have years to catch up
I need to keep my usb mouse/keyboard working for the moment.
I'm still doing everything without lan cable attached. When it's the time to try RDC, i'll study how to connect to my lan only. I dont think will be easy, so I'm posponing it after critical listening in the old setup & usb3 first.

[PeterSt]

Oh, yes, what do I need to send you for activation? Can we do it offline?

Yep, still possible as always. It is only that I need to be there to apply the procedure manually.

Peter

[Telstar]

Noname usb3 card with renesas chipset installed.
Belkin usb2 highspeed standard cable plugged and ready to transmit all the cr*p in the world 
Listening tests after weekend

[PeterSt]

[Telstar]

After the very first comparisons, I can say with a certain sureness that I'm not going back to windows7 ever.
That drive will soon be wiped and removed from the PC.

Aside, I'll order a Lush cable soon.