XXHighEnd PC with Windows 10 from RAM

[PeterSt]

Hi All,

Following up on this :
And now my sound is SCARY
I'd like to apply some changes to the XXHighEnd PC :

At this moment, and for the time being, the XXHighEnd PC will be shipped with :

Edit April 2016 : This "time being" has ended.
See here : General Description of the XXHighEnd PC and also here : Super Offer - XXHighEnd PC for 975 !!

- a 2.5" hdd with Windows 8 Pro + license;
- a 2.5" hdd with Windows 10 Pro Preview, build 10074, meant to fully operate from RAM.

The 500GB hdd as well as the 2.5" SSD will not be part of the shipment any more.

The (still silent) dedicated (and analog rev-controlled) chassis fans will not be electrically connected (hence won't be operative by default, but they can be connected when wanted).

Reason for this strategy change :

At first the XXHighEnd PC was meant to cover for all the needs for Audio Playback, including the housing of the music itself, by means of hdd or by means of USB connections. This strategy has changed (for the better SQ of course) into :

a. Connect as few as possible to the Audio PC (which means totally nothing);
b. Have the music somewhere behind the LAN (another PC or a NAS etc.).

Ad a.
The provided hdd with Windows, by default boots the Operating System into RAM. After that, the hdd can be removed from its removable (and hot-pluggable) bay.
Do notice that all the provisions are there to apply changes - now performed in RAM - to permanent storage (re-mount the W10 hdd and let XXHighEnd apply the changes).

The provided W8 hdd implies the more normal situation, but with still the strategy that as few as possible is to be connected to the PC. Thus, the only difference with the W10 hdd is that W10 is meant to run from RAM (but can also be used in normal fashion) while W8 is meant to run normally from the HDD.

The XXHighEnd PC will be shipped with XXHighEnd 2.03 (or higher) - needed to support the "Windows 10 from RAM";
You don't need to do anything to let this all work and booting will automatically be to/from RAM. Tutorials to let all work seamlessly with the music behind the LAN somewhere, are available.

Regards,
Peter

[music33]

Hi Peter,
A few questions -
Do you plan on using the official Windows 10 version when it is released?
Can you plug in a USB drive instead of using a NAS - is there sound quality difference?  I'm not sure what you mean behind the LAN, doesn't a NAS or another computer need to be part of the same LAN as the XXHIghEnd PC?
If you make changes to settings I assume you need to boot from the physical hard drive, run XXHighEnd from the physical hard drive, make changes, save to the physical drive and then reboot the OS into RAM.
Anything else you experimented with - grounding, clocks, separate USB cards?
Many thanks,
Dave

[Robert]

Hi Peter,
            I presume you have nothing connected via USB to PC. And you have all fans disconnected.
Is this now because running W10 in Ram runs cooler or you have been running no fans anyway?

Robert
 

[Mamba315]

Is this upgrade possible for existing XXHE PC owners?  Apologies if I have missed the answer somewhere.

[PeterSt]

Is this upgrade possible for existing XXHE PC owners?  Apologies if I have missed the answer somewhere.

Matt, your question is justified, because I "had to" leave it out. This is because :

1. It's daft to not supply anything of this for new PC owners while it's all working;
2. It's also a kind of daft to now hastily supply it to 50-60 others while the RTM (Release To Manufacture) version is around the corner.

Especially #1 is a bit tough because people want a PC "today" and supply nothing of W10, waiting for ... how long ? again is daft. Again, it all just works, works very fine and even more importantly : SQ is superb (in my view).

More in a next post ...

[PeterSt]

Hi Peter,
            I presume you have nothing connected via USB to PC. And you have all fans disconnected.
Is this now because running W10 in Ram runs cooler or you have been running no fans anyway?

Hi Robert,

The honest answer is actually : coincidence;
Just over a year ago I had to take apart my Audio PC for the Linear PSU project (put on hold in the end) and my Audio PC ended up with the OS-hdd attached as the only thing. Fans were disconnected as well, because they disturbed the boot process. So my PC ended up as you see below and it has been so for a year. All what's connected is the removable bay drive you see in the bottom-left, an USB cable for the DAC and an ethernet cable for the LAN/music.
How tempting it was all this time (a year) to remove the HDD from the bay, which you actually now see happened (it sticks out). PC is just running ...

Shorter answer (is it ?) :
With MinOS and further settings, nothing gets hot in there anyway from the CPU's perspective (CPU package temperature is 40C/104F only) and all what's further warm is the MoBo (always under 40C). Lastly, the OS Disk radiates heat, but when used as intended that's "nothing". Notice that "intended" is a few accesses per minute only, if at all (this, while continuous use of the hdd can make it 100C/212F++ easily). This too is arranged for by XXHighEnd.
So with this hdd all is already sufficiently cool and without it ... it hardly matters.

Peter

[PeterSt]

PS: I notice myself - watching that picture - that the video card is still in there (the thing with the cooling ribs), but that can also go out since all can be done from RDC/RDP;
I haven't had connected the monitor (and mouse+keyoard) for weeks.

[PeterSt]

Dave,

Do you plan on using the official Windows 10 version when it is released?

Difficult to say at this moment. One answer is :
I see many more reasons why *not* to do that, than do it. Anyway I myself have no single reason to do it.
Additionally, it will only mean work for me. It takes one thing only to do nothing : keep that 10074 build available (and I will take care of that anyway).

Also notice - and this may not be so obvious to everyone - that the 10074 build *really* is free, does not show nasty adds(ware) and does NOT require an existing W8(.1) or W7 license. The final build will (and you will lose the licensing right on the other one. Of course you can normally buy Windows 10 to avoid issues in this context.
Summarized : W10 is not free at all. You're hoaxed to some extent. Still, such a Preview is free, but don't ask me how long it will last. I could not find data on that (like the W8 Consumer preview worked for 15 or so months only).

Not to forget : people tend to think that this build is not stable. Well, maybe if you try to do your work on it. But for us and what we do with it ? It is SUPER STABLE. I never saw even the slightest hiccup from it and it is running for 6-7 weeks in a row now (2 weeks off for vacation) - never needing a reboot, apart from my testing stuff.
But to keep in mind : XXHighEnd anticipates on a few things, and arranges for that explicitly.

Can you plug in a USB drive instead of using a NAS - is there sound quality difference?

But of course. But sadly this is exactly the way NOT to go any more. Not for the better SQ ...

I'm not sure what you mean behind the LAN, doesn't a NAS or another computer need to be part of the same LAN as the XXHIghEnd PC?

Sorry for that, as it could be too much of Dutch. But try to read the "behind" as something like a black box; invsible; "somewhere".
Anyway, just LAN connected.

Possibly because you didn't get that, I now don't understand the last part of your question here. But the answer is obviously (?) Yes.

If you make changes to settings I assume you need to boot from the physical hard drive, run XXHighEnd from the physical hard drive, make changes, save to the physical drive and then reboot the OS into RAM.

No. Normal sequence is this :

- Prepare the lot once (this is the super tough part, "undoable" already for explaning).

- (A) Boot (this is from hdd into RAM and goes automatically)
- Detach hdd
- Apply changes via XXHighEnd as you like (ad-hoc / on the fly, etc.).
- (B) Shutdown (XXHighEnd will now ask you to re-attach the hdd and applies the changes to the permenent storage for you).
- Go to sleep, work, etc.
- Back to (A).

During the process of (B) you are asked to really shutdown, continue, OR continue with the permenent storage attached and accessible FOR YOU. This is the situation that you can apply anything to permanent storage. Example : Such a question (by XXHighEnd) for renaming a particular .tst file to .tss so "the" question won't be asked next time. So you did that in the RAM version, but will also want to do that in the permenant storage so it applies at the next boot to RAM.
Also see below picture (again); default boot is into RAM. But be there to choose the "BASE version" and you have the normal OS from hdd, apply all you like in there (like you're used to with your wildest tweaks and whatever), play music if you like for testing, to next reboot (automatically) to RAM again, and find your changes applied in there.
That's all.

Anything else you experimented with - grounding, clocks, separate USB cards?

Uhm, of course. But by the time such things bring real results, I usually let it know. Haha.

Regards,
Peter

[music33]

Hi Peter,
So XXHighEnd knows to save your changes to the hdd (very cool).  In essence this PC really can only be used for xxhighend and nothing else.  I say this as no other application is going to ask you to re-attach the hdd ;-)

I don't know much about lans, so a few simple questions - are we talking a wireless lan or hard-wired?  Can I get a NAS and just do point to point wiring or do I need to get a router?

With a stripped down version of the PC I would think some of things I mentioned like grounding would have less of an impact.  Perhaps a stripped down version of a motherboard would also help.

FYI -
I've been looking into products that people have put in their computers to help clean the power supply -

Bybee Rails (second link is someone who installed them in there computer, need to scroll down a bit)

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0111/bybee_music_rails.htm

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f8-general-forum/bybee-music-rail-question-14278/

AudioMagic Pulse Gen ZX (second link is someone who installed them in there computer)

http://www.audio-magic.com/Prod-PulseGenZX.html
http://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/t.mpl?f=tweaks&m=154427

I have no affiliation with either company.  I have added both of these to components I have already owned with excellent results. 

[music33]

I found I can connect a NAS directly to a computer using static IP addresses.  My question is if the OS is always loaded into RAM how do I make configuration changes in Windows that will be saved.  I'm obviously missing something.
thanks,
dave

[PeterSt]

Hi Dave,

are we talking a wireless lan or hard-wired?  Can I get a NAS and just do point to point wiring or do I need to get a router?

Hard-wired. And you can use a router, but point-to-point is advised.

So XXHighEnd knows to save your changes to the hdd (very cool).  In essence this PC really can only be used for xxhighend and nothing else.

Nah, sort of;
If you dive more into XXHighEnd you will see/learn that RAMDisk operation requires an environmental "set up" that allows to save the changes WITHIN XXHIGHEND to permanent storage. Nothing super special about that, apart from it being very convenient that it happens.
The same thing now happens to our next dimension of RAM and permanent storage.

So you can try to think another way around :
Suppose you use JRiver, dunk that yourself to RAMDisk and change settings in there - now hope that provisions have been made by JRMC to save those settings for you to permanent storage.
This is unrelated to your quote, if you only also grasp this :

All OTHER means of changes, like given example of renaming a file, is not done by XXHighEnd. Still you can do that redundantly yourself. Think a virtual machine not allowing write changes, while you still want to change the base (you want to apply the writes after all). Normally this requires a re-gen of the OS. I did it more smart (sort of because I ain't - and if I was I would have made an incremental change to permenent storage (like backups can work)).

And do notice that we talk "Audio PC" and not a work PC or something. And worse : We talk about the physical XXHighEnd PC as well, because regarding drivers etc. I made it for that (sh*t happens with a pre-configured OS).

Clear a bit ?
Ah, I'm sure it already was. But true, you could say that this (PC) is for XXHighEnd only. But, what's the difference with a Virtual Machine without writing through changes, which is always for "a" purpose ?
The difference is that external factors now first imply the "no writes" (because we're in RAM) and that now provisions must be found/created to apply those changes after all. Just for convenience.

Peter

[Gerard]

Peter,

You talked about a usb stick instead of a HDD before.
Would that also be possible? Would make it a lot easyer in my setup. 

[fmanheck]

If someone (like me) already has an XXhighend PC, can it be updated to this current status w/ windows 10???

[PeterSt]

Hi Fred  - for sure Yes.

Regards,
Peter

[toddn]

Hey Peter,

I'm kind of like Mani right now. I've been so swamped with other things, I have not even had a chance to mess with my audio system.

I purchased a new SSD, downloaded the correct build of Windows 10 probably almost two months ago and the SSD is still in its sealed box & I haven't even put Windows on a bootable disc. Pretty pathetic.

Anyway I'd like to purchase the whole package, and if I haven't already  bought the license for the latest XX by the time your ready to ship it out to me we'll add that in too.
 
I'm really looking forward to getting back to my audio. I've got some new woodworking equipment coming in and I'm getting ready to pair a bunch of 101db sensitive 15" drivers in an open baffle setup with my BD Orphean horns. I've already got some cool finish ideas with some carbon fiber sheeting & Ferrari Rossa Corsa paint. Definitely won't be subtle

Once again Peter, thank you for continuing to advance all ends of the playback chain. It's easy to rekindle our audio passion with you around!!!
Todd