In anticipation of my "nearly" new Orelino Speakers

[Scroobius]

Last week Bert advised me that my "nearly" new Orelino's are due here early September. So today in a frenzy of activity I got the chisel out. The problem in my room is that what cannot go over the carpet has to go under.

More to follow on why my Orelino's are "nearly" new and why I decided to splash out a lot of money on a pair of speakers the sound of which I was not entirely happy with.

Paul

[manisandher]

Bloody hell Paul... I hope it all proves worth while. Looking forward to getting a chance to hear in person at some point.

Mani.

[AlainGr]

Hi Paul,

I concur with Mani. I sure hope you will be happy with your choice.

It will not be of much help, but when I got the Tannoy, I really was not convinced with what I heard before I made my decision. But I did get them after all. I am happy today, but the process was long and sometimes I was really not sure.

What is hard is that passed over a certain level, things can get so sharp that it becomes complicated. Sometimes getting a new component will mean "change another", sometimes one will decide not to keep a component because it requires too much... Money can also be an important factor in our attempt to "accept" something or turn it into something positive. Ultimately it comes to some difficult questions, questions that are not easy to share with others. I try hard not to disappoint anyone, but if I disappoint myself...  

From what I have read from you throughout time, I am sure you will find your way, as you are a "fighter"

But please, do not rebuild your home !!!!

Alain

[christoffe]

But please, do not rebuild your home !!!!

Alain

Good advice, but Paul is on "Cloud Nine"

Joachim

[AlainGr]

Good advice, but Paul is on "Cloud Nine"

Joachim

[Scroobius]

But please, do not rebuild your home !!!

Actually it looks significantly worse than it really was as it took only 5 hours to do the complete job including waiting for the fast dry cement to dry. So just about the same time as a long bike ride which I do often (but didn't do yesterday ha ha).

However during all the discussions (or rather negotiations) with my (much) better half about the new speakers I must have forgotten to mention that I would have to burrow under the house as part of the install. Anyway all done now with just a draw string at each end to show for the work.

And Ros was not around when I was doing it so no problems!!!

Cheers

Paul

[Scroobius]

So today there was a new power outlet to install...........

A relatively short job (compared with the chiselling of yesterday).

So why do we have such large power sockets in the UK? - I don't know - the European alternatives look more sensible to me!!!!

[PeterSt]

Btw, what I wonder Paul,

Why do some of us install audiophile fuses in our devices + electricity room while you there (in the UK)  have stupid fuses in the mains cords ? Shouldn't you remove/shortcut those ?

Peter

[Scroobius]

have stupid fuses in the mains cords ?

Yea stupid fuses everywhere - in the dis box, balanced supply transformer, NOS1a, Amps and of course in the plugs of all the power chords. Expect that with my hi-fi gear (and not shown above) I use special outlets which allow you to screw the power chords direct in - so no stupid plugs.

[Scroobius]

And while I mention Balanced Transformers I am considering how to configure the mains supply for my system with the (nearly) new Orelino's. I shall of course have a separate mains ring for Music PC, NOS1a and amps (in Orelino's) all supplied via a separate dedicated earth. Which is what I have at the moment (that will entail lifting floor boards in the upstairs bedroom - more fun and more photo's to come    )

However in the current setup the power supply for the hi-fi kit comes from a dedicated balanced transformer. The balanced transformer provides the benefit of a very very quiet earth (which is also dedicated via a spike in the garden). So that is a GOOD THING. However, at the end of the day it is a transformer with great big coils of wire in it which MAY limit the transient response of the system. And that could be a BAD THING. Now it will not be too difficult for me to test the difference between balanced supply and normal supply when I get my new speakers (uurrggh more work). And of course I shall report back on the results.

However, I was just wondering if anyone out there has tried it? Bert or Peter have you tried it? I would of course expect the new Orelino's to be much faster on transients than my current speakers so while I have not really noticed a difference before I may well now.

[Scroobius]

I will be posting about all my experiences relating to my "nearly" new Orelinos so expect a number of posts upcoming.

And of course I shall be totally honest as I know that Peter expects nothing less!!

But first of all why "nearly" new. I recently had an away day (or two) in Holland and was fortunate enough to stay at Peter's for a night and to experience his excellent hospitality. Apart from me dutifully wearing a pair of orange socks (the things one does to keep ones hosts happy!!) and sitting down in the evening to watch Holland in the semi finals of the World Cup (with Ciska, Paul and Peter) we of course listened to Peter's Orello MkII's. I will cover that listening experience in a separate post.

During the evening though we went down into Peter's basement and had a forage around. And low and behold there were the "original" prototype Orelino's. Seemingly forgotten and unloved they were in pieces and spread around the basement floor. These were the original Orelino prototypes that Bert spent many hours and many months of toil building. They are the very same pair that ended up at the X-Fi show (see attached photo).

Prior to the visit I had been carefully measuring my room to see how I could fit the Orelino's in. Peter very obligingly spent much time emailing over exact dimensions until I was satisfied that I could fit them in (I hope I can anyway!!).

So that was it I decided (more on why in a later post) to buy a pair and having measured them in the basement they would fit (just!!!!). But for sure they will dominate the room!.

But that is not the end of the story - I subsequently found out from Peter and Bert that future Orelino's will not be the same as those prototypes. This is for various commercial and build (i.e. not technical) reasons. All future Orelino's will be essentially cut down Orello MkII's. So in other words the panel in future Orelino's will be the same as the MkII but not as high. That is entirely logical and Peter assured that there will be no performance difference.

However, that created a problem. The dimensions of the "new" Orelino/MkII panel (flatter with wider throat) is not good to fit my room. The deeper profile with narrower throat of the prototype fits my room better.

But then more problems!! - the prototype Orelino speakers were finished hurriedly probably to meet the show deadline and so needed more work by a carpenter to meet Bert's very high standards. Also there were no electronics and indeed no back panel at all. All the electronics of the prototype Orelino's were in boxes cunningly hidden under a table at X-Fi. I think Peter told me that in confidence so that is between just you and me OK?.

That is why Bert has been very busy recently because he has had to have built special sized back panels just for the electronics and much other work besides. So really they are completely re-worked. 

And what of the finish? - well luckily the finish is exactly what I would have chosen for my room anyway. The veneer looks great. I might have considered light coloured horns but on reflection I suspect it would have been difficult to get exactly the right shade to match the veneer so as they are they are just about what I would have chosen anyway.

So that was lucky!!

Anyway that is the story of my "nearly" new Orelino's. And for me I have to say I have sold them to myself on the basis that they will be exclusive to me and another pair the same will never ever be made!!

Cheers

Paul

 
 

[manisandher]

Now it will not be too difficult for me to test the difference between balanced supply and normal supply when I get my new speakers (uurrggh more work)...

... However, I was just wondering if anyone out there has tried it?

Hi Paul, I would have tried this a while ago... but just couldn't figure out an 'apples for apples' comparison. And what I'm talking about is the dedicated earth.

Here at my place, I'm getting 0.5V potential difference between my dedicated earth and my house's AC mains earth. The resistance is 5M Ohms, so there's very, very little current flowing between the two. I'm assuming they can be considered pretty well 'isolated'.

So the two scenarios are 1) with the transformer in place (for the sake of simplicity, let's just consider a non-balanced transformer here), and 2) without the transformer:

1). I can bond the dedicated earth to the Neutral of the secondary to effectively create a 'new' TNS mains network... totally (with the caveat above) isolated from the house's AC mains.

2). In this case, what do I connect the dedicated earth to? The house's AC mains earth? Seems a bit pointless to me. And also we need to bear in mind that here in the UK, we usually use TNC-S mains which means the AC mains earth is bonded the Neutral at the entry point. So I suppose the only option is to go for a T-T network. But there's now a potential difference between the Neutral and the dedicated earth - what affect does this have, if any?

So, I suppose what I'm saying is that yes, it would be easy to compare using a transformer with dedicated earth against no transformer and no dedicated earth. But I can't see how you could really compare using a transformer with dedicated earth against no transformer but still using a dedicated earth.

What am I not seeing here?

Mani.

[Scroobius]

Hi Mani - for the test I was going to not connect the dedicated earth (i.e. the spike in the garden) but connect the mains earth through to the centre tap earth on the secondary of the balanced transformer. That is not a problem and is actually the way the transformer was connected originally. That way the test would be "apples" versus "apples".

In this case, what do I connect the dedicated earth to? The house's AC mains earth?

That's the default standard for the balanced transformer should not be a problem.

As I am only interested in how a transformer may affect transient response I am not interested in the earth other than it is quiet and similar in both set ups. So should work OK.

[manisandher]

Yep agreed, that'll give you an 'apples vs. apples' comparison.

The only thing missing would be the affect of the dedicated earth, i.e. not connecting the mains earth through the centre tap, but having the mains earth on the primary and the dedicated earth on the secondary (with a double-pole RCD or RCBO on the output for safety). Even if the balanced transformer is negatively affecting transients, this might be off-set by the positives of using a dedicated earth.

So you're probably best doing a 3-way comparison.

FWIW, over here I currently have things set up as follows:

- 63A D-curve MCB in CU to 15KVA isolation transformer (with 16A RCBO on output), with dedicated earth bonded to secondary Neutral, powering all linear power supply equipment
- 20A MCB in CU to 5KVA balanced transformer (with 16A RCBO on output), with dedicated earth bonded to centre tap of secondary, powering PC SMPS

I have a 'noise sniffer' (rated at 100Hz to 2MHz) which generally goes ballistic anywhere near a SMPS. I've tested the balanced transformer itself, and it reduces the PC's SMPS noise a little. But with my current configuration (1x isolation transformer and 1x balanced transformer), no PC SMPS noise seems to be getting through to the power strip that powers the (linear power supply) equipment. Even on it's most sensitive setting, with the hifi system in full swing, the sniffer registers '0'.

Mani.

[pedal]

Here is a worthwhile tip, for those who's stereo share the mains with certain household electronics:

Several specialist companies feature Schaffner mains line filters inside their equipment.

SCHAFFNER filters can be bought separately too, for a modest price. You should go for a multi stage kind for maximum noise attenuation.

Now comes the funny part: Switch the direction of the filter (swap the male/female plug) so the filter works outbound (in "reverse" direction). Then you put it in line, prior to your coffee brewer, refrigerator and other possible noise sources. The point is that such components leaks noise back into the mains circuit.

-This tweak is not commonly known. I learnt it from my old friend, who used to design and manufacture high end amplifiers and electronics.

(Electronics, like a coffee brewer, featuring a thyristor can generate terrible high amounts of mains distortion).

THYRISTOR: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thyristor