First impression of the NOS1a (and Orelo)

[vrao]

Yo Mani,
Congrats dude!!
Even though your comments sounds a bit harsh, I'll take it with a grain of salt, afterall we are all a bit crazy!
Mine might take a while ... so you "will" hear from me again 
Afterall Peter's ravings were with the NOS-1 for about a year now
Looking forward to your impressions!!!
Cheers,
VJ

[manisandher]

Hey VJ, sorry, didn't mean to sound in any way harsh towards you. Thanks for accommodating my over-enthusiasm.

Strangely, my comments were almost directed more to myself than anyone else. You see, until today I've been using my Pacific Microsonics Model Two (with my other NOS1 still with Scroobius) and the difference between that and the NOS1a is just huge. The former makes the Orelos sound pretty ordinary, irrespective of F-M or whatever. But with the NOS1a, things just start falling into place. Interestingly, more so low down than anywhere else - there's now real LF energizing the room. Although to be fair, the whole sound is transformed. From recollection, there was always a difference between the NOS1 and the PM2. But this difference is now a gulf with the NOS1a.

More later...

Mani.

[vrao]

Hey Mani,
No worries bro...
I suspect 1a is a huge step up considering both you and Peter are smittened by it.
Good to hear your progress..
Vj

[manisandher]

Previously, when discovering music before, I would listen to less than one minute of a song or few songs on CDs for sampling, now, I tend to listen to the entire album.

Yep, this is exactly what I'm experiencing. (Almost missed the start of the Brazil/Croatia match because of it.)

Mani.

[manisandher]

Since receiving my 'white-sheep-with-golden-a' back yesterday afternoon, I've been almost afraid of playing around with any XX dials, just in case I can actually still hear a difference. Well, this morning I took the plunge, and...

... phew, they really seem to make absolutely no difference whatsoever. SFS from 0.5 to 2.0 to 120.0 - no difference. Clock res from 0.5s to 10s to 'nothing' - no difference.

I can't describe in words how happy this makes me. Finally, finally, we're rid of the influence of the PC on SQ, and can actually use it as it was intended - a wonderfully flexible and incredibly powerful tool.

All this because of Peter's love of a challenge. Man, if you were here right now, I'd kiss you.

Mani.

[manisandher]

I'd really like to write something about the sound of the NOS1a. But what to write? The only thing that really jumps out is the sheer 'musicality'. I mean, instruments don't just sound 'clear' now (they did before) but actually very beautiful. They shimmer and resonate in sympathy to the music. Weirdly, I can almost see the colour and grain of their wood (or shine of their metal). I don't mean to say that these cues are embedded in the music - of course not. But it's almost as though my mind is now free of doing any unnecessary processing making sense of the sound and can rather drift and wonder about the other elements of the musical experience.

Sorry, probably not expressing myself very well.

Mani.

[manisandher]

OK, final quick thought for now. If you have a NOS1 already and have not put yourself on the list for the NOS1a upgrade, do it right now. It's a total no-brainer.

Mani.

[PeterSt]

But it's almost as though my mind is now free of doing any unnecessary processing making sense of the sound and can rather drift and wonder about the other elements of the musical experience.

Sorry, probably not expressing myself very well.

But something like that *is* happening. And I guess we should ask VJ for the real "connection" ... he might not know at this moment, but he will find out ...

To me, without the real knowledge, we can compare our brain to the CPU and all (PC) around it; when it has to do other things besides audio processing, that creates noise and it influences its given main task (audio processing).

Side note : I am not saying this because of seeking explanations because you come up with this Mani - I just encountered it myself and wonder ...

The example of being able to get used to watching WC football (or however it's called in the various countries) up side down is in the area of what will be happening; it needs (huge) adaption but can be done and in the end you are used to it. Maybe though "struggle" remains when the ball goes to the ground automatically which as how you see it would still be wrong (because you see it fall upwards) but in the whole picture it wouild be consistent. Still processing remains needed because it is not right really.

I also think that our brain may be able to do few multi threading (multi processing) but not all that much (but just guessing).

Here is what was my very first observation at listening to this :
(it's a kind of shocking)

I mean, instruments don't just sound 'clear' now

With this at hand - and possibly it is no coincidence that you mentioned it Mani - I played a first album of my ever "beloved" ambient test-sh*t. Well, it must have been at track 3 that unconsciously I thought track 1 must be in a loop. Were we really at track 3 ? So I started to pay attention and hmm, a clear difference between that track and a next one. So no loop.

I was doing the same as always, which especially means something else than listening to music. Talk some, cook some, beer some.

Then I started a next album, and of course I was placeboed by things being possibly wrong. All was electrically different but in a way anything could happen. Not exactly sure how, but I was pretty sure that this next album was the same as the previous one. However, I wasn't sure and probaly was on to the fridge for a next beer and since I was merely interested in the beauty I heard I let it go (again). Yes, why not relisten to the same for better observation (with thus no explicit listening at hand).

But it wasn't the same album. I explicitly checked later because Logging was on anyway.
So

Mind you, this is not The Beatles with super clear melodies and lyrics, so try to envision that such a thing can happen anyway.

The next day I was thinking this over. I recall that I even started out with the same album I started out with the day before - just to check what was going on. And this was/is my thinking :

Before there was always very explicit jumping out of particular things. Hard to give examples, but think of a fly buzzing from left to right in a most explicit way. Emphasized things. And yes, notice that with this kind of music these "tricks" happen all over. It is actually of great interest and this is why I like this kind of "music". But it also is usually on the edge or maybe just over. Anyway, because of on the egde it jumps out. It characterizes the track and it is how you recall it from the last time played. Just thinking of an example in more normal music : thunder. So a track could contain thunder and you know it is in there and actually wait for it. And when the thunder does not appears you are totally confused. Did I miss the track ? is it the next one then ? Anyway :

In my vision all now blends in the meant whole. Still, it can hardly be so that thunder is not there any more (about it being in or out of the cues). But something else happens. Like the music now telling you that thunder will be coming (classical is good at such things) and when it finally strikes, well, you are not surprised. And for that reason it doesn't even occur much. It belongs to it. Has been blended in.
In what ?
In what or by what - but your mind.

Nothing jumps out because no processing is needed to render it; Render something which is not quite right. Or which can't be. Or does not fit. Or shows harmonics which don't belong for/to what you are used to.
Maybe that does not sound bad as such, but at least your brain puts the focus to it for additional processing ?

Peter

[vrao]

Guys,
Edit: sometimes a morning does of coffee works wonders .... So

"I guess we should ask VJ for the real "connection"

Ofcouse I have an answer, at least a part of it ...

Lower order auditory pathways are pretty much a reflex action. This is the defense mechanism from millions of years of evolution. Near instantaneous, for fight or flight. This has been perfected by evolution itself, and we can all pat ourselves on the back, and say we are on the forefront of this technology. Those who didn't probably got buried under a stampede of wooly mammoths I guess .....
Stereo reproduction fails in eliciting this pathway naturally, and causes listener fatigue. If this does not pass, what follows thro with the rest of the music is not processed as real. When one does get thro this gateway in the natural fashion, it can open doors to a multitude of higher order brain functions (edit: not the same for localization), which is very complex.
Anyways Mani, you reflect my experience with a very strong visual feedback to the music .... Borderlines .... synesthesia
I think we are well beyond sound stage, tone recognition ..... the usual audiophile stuff,   with higher order processing. Now we are seeing music as a whole, like the artist intended. Music as a portrait!

Happy listening
VJ

[manisandher]

Next up could be a new filter.

I've just been playing around with HQPlayer. This is the only other player I'm aware of that allows up to 24/768 to be fed to the NOS1(a). What's really interesting about this player is that it has a bunch of filters and noise-shaping tools to try. With the NOS1a and the Orelo speakers, the different sounds of these filters is easily heard.

To cut a long story short, I still prefer the sound of XX's Arc Prediction to any of the filters in HQP. The two 'polynomial' filters in HQP have a similar sort of sound to AP, but not quite as 'full'. But some of the other filters in HQP have a lot more LF energy than AP, with a softer mid and high end. With the Orelos, this is quite nice though obviously not as accurate as AP.

I would love a filter that sounds essentially like AP, but that has a weightier (but still accurate) bottom end. So Peter, when's the new XX filter available?

Mani.

[PeterSt]

Hey Mani,

I would love a filter that sounds essentially like AP, but that has a weightier (but still accurate) bottom end.

So, we can work this out en public. And let's say that we both should be careful; some may lose some may win. And it is literally about that in my opinion. So if you have an example album/track for me I can try to work it out from my side; I will tell you whether I have it and if not you can (please) send it to me.
Anyway I think this should be educational (not only for me and/or you).

Peter

[manisandher]

So if you have an example album/track for me I can try to work it out from my side

OK, let's go for track 3 (September) on 'Sephyra' by Artemis. I have the 24/44.1 FLAC which I've sent you a link for downloading.

This is a very clean recording. With 16x AP (yes, I still prefer double octo) it's a bit too lean low down. With some of the HQP filters, the balance is perfect... but the overall sound way too soft, with a clear softening of transients.

Mani.

[manisandher]

Thanks for the insight VJ. Very interesting stuff.

Stereo reproduction fails in eliciting this pathway naturally, and causes listener fatigue.

It's funny - I never seem to get listener fatigue on a mediocre system. Only on a 'pretty good' system. I think with the former, my brain knows immediately that it's a simple reproduction and doesn't even bother trying to make anything out of it. But on a good system, I think the brain is uncertain whether it's a reproduction or is real and therefore the extra processing kicks in. Of course, this is pure speculation on my part.

For their part, the Orelos are scarily real with some stuff.

Mani.

[juanpmar]

Hey Mani,

Congratulations on your new sound, I hope you enjoy it and I hope that we, the ones that are on the list for new NOS1a, can enjoy at least a part of that sound.
Are you using the cables that I sent you?

I see you're following the World Cup. For us, Dutch and Spanish, today is the day. May the best win! (I hope it's Spain hahaha). Well, lets play fair: Good luck also to the Oranje!

Juan

[vrao]

Hey Mani,
Thanks for your feedback.
It's difficult to address specific things on the web, with all angles covered.
Localization what I'm talking Bout is a reflex process, it does not go to your higher brain, this is the one that will make you jump instantaneously, cause chills etc.
Some stereo systems magnify errors more than others,  and therefore failure of acceptable stereo illusion as you said, higher order (edit: for localization) processing kicks in. There are multitude of indicators, and some are rejected at phase 1, you can say.