XX Stopping

[PeterSt]

Bert, can't this be solved just the same by killing XXEngine3 ?

I do recognize something of this; this wasn't so before. But for example, changing the SFS makes XXEngine3 die (not XX(HigheEnd) as you suggest).

So, just thinking along with you all; something is not working as before (can it be W8 related ?).

Peter

[juanpmar]

Today I played several albums with lPhase deactivated and I haven´t had the stops problem. If I activate lPhase the stops return. So at least in my system it looks related with the lPhase.

These are the messages I receive when the sound stops:

Set sample rate
Failed to set sample rate


Fail!
Engine #4 did not start within the expected time !


XXEngine3.exe
XXEngine3.exe has stopped working
A problem caused the program to stop working correctly. Please close the program.


The Output device #4 Engine doesn´t respond and I have to  reboot XX, after this reboot when I try to activate #4 Engine this is the message that appears:

Check Engine Settings
Phase Aligment will be deactivated. OK

Once I click Ok lPhase is deactivated and #4 Engine works again. This way, playing with the lPhase unclicked there are no more stops.

Juan

[BertD]

Bert, can't this be solved just the same by killing XXEngine3 ?

I meant to say Killing XXEngine3.. that little blue clickable icon at the right side of the XX window.

But even restarting XX does not help, only a reboot is doing the trick for me.

My problems so far basically only related to changing the playback drive though.

Bert

[PeterSt]

Juan,

(the below may come across as harsh, but this is not intended at all and I only try to point out the importance of things. Ok ?)

Please remember once and for all and ever : With Phase Alignment On, stops are incurred for when the buffers can not be filled with samples because no samples are provided.
This by itself is caused by a too slow PC / Disk Subsystem BUT can easly be implied by dialing in settings which can't be dealt with by your PC. It is all as logic as can be, which btw doesn't tell that you know what to do to prevent it. However, while any newbie won't know where to go, you as an experienced user should. But you HAVE to understand what the underlaying culprit is first. And I just told about that ...

We also have to understand the behaviour of W8 which is different from W7. I can't help that. So for example try this :
Set SFS to 2 and Logging On - and Phase Alignment On.
You can't play a thing now while W7 just allows it.

What shall I do to prevent newbies from running into this ? and to prevent experienced users like you from running into this ?
Right. Don't allow SFS under 20 or whatever.

Happy ?

No.
And this is how we HAVE to understand what's happening.

And hey, I didn't tell you that you or anyone *can* understand. Heck, I don't even understand myself a couple of things in this area. What is and remains though is that we have to. We need to when we like to dial in our best settings for SQ. If that can't work for W8, then make some choices.

... Which all, of course, doesn't mean that I don't like to help out or try to solve things in the base.

Without Phase Alignment and things never stopping in this context, you WILL perceive silences. Whether they are large enough to actually hear it is something else. But say it is as bad as stopping. You just went over the top with your PC and everything contributing to it (like Playback Drive) and what we actually talk about now : the OS.

Never think it is stupid to mention these things. IOW, with the above it is not my intention to stop anyone from mentioning these things. The contrary, I *need* this feedback in order to ever get that something now (suddenly) easily is the matter while before (W7) it was not at all. This, while for me and also others it is as easy to not run into the problem anyway; different PC, different settings, different hdd speeds ... what not.

Like my SFS=2 and Logging example. I don't know why. I can only TELL that W8 is way more slow somewhere.

Regards,
Peter

[juanpmar]

Hi Peter, no problem, you´re right I should know certain technical things, the problem is that my educational background in Art and Literature don't help very much on this regard. When I discovered XXHE I had to learn how to build a computer, I did it and I´m glad that what I learnt helped others to build their systems. Unfortunately it doesn´t mean that I know further than clicking here or there to get the best possible sound. That´s not a justification but I claim also for the right of the less technical savvy to enjoy XX which is today, in my already long experience as audiophile, the best way to get first class sound. The problem for all of us, but even more for the people like me, is that XX is always evolving and has to be adapted also to a new version of Windows every so often. Please be patient with me, I´ll do my best to keep learning.

Returning to the settings, to avoid stops now I´ve changed with good results to SFS: 32 and up. Experimenting.

Best regards,
Juan

[charliemb]

I'm thinking that this may relate to this problem, still unsolved:

http://www.phasure.com/index.php?topic=2367.msg24576#msg24576

I bares some resemblance.  One difference is that the stopping is not exactly = hitting the stop button.  Instead, it stops and continues to the next song.

[PeterSt]

Ehm, please confirm :

You press Stop and what comes from it is that the next track plays ??

[charliemb]

Ehm, please confirm :

You press Stop and what comes from it is that the next track plays ??

Oops!   Sorry for the delay in response. 

No, in my case I never actually hit the stop button.   But the song / track stops playing and xxHE almost instantly starts playing the next song / track.   Sometimes it's hard tell that it made the jump to the next track, when the music is similar depending on the passage.

The stopping of this thread is similar to that of the other thread if the stops occur mid-track.

[Scroobius]

I was just looking back at my original post which was 8 Jan and at that time I was on W7 and I had the "stopping" problem (but none of the other error messages). I was using remote control bluetooth then which worked fine.

And then W8 came along and with it all kinds of problems that Bluetooth remote seemed to cause (I never did get that working with W8). That is when the random stopping and error messages started even after restore to "ground zero".

Eventually I made a complete reinstallation of W8 keeping it very simple. End of stopping and error message problems.

And along the way I also made fresh install (on a separate disc) of W7 again keeping it simple. End of stopping and error messages.

So for me at least I will not be installing Bluetooth again - of course in W7 who knows what caused the stopping but I will always now keep my installs very simple.

Cheers

Paul

[PeterSt]

Ok, one thing that I only found recently :

I too have stops as long as the SFS is low (like the 1 I am playing with currently). Mind you, these are stops which are not captured by the program which right away is the reason why playback continues after this stop. For Phase Alignment this means plop ... plop (one for the stop and one for the continued playback). That it isn't detected by the program can only be because all stands still; something is holding up everything. Btw, I talk W7 here.
The period the stop lasts to me looks like a disk needs spinning up, and it can vary somewhat (I use many disks in there). But say it can easily be 7-8 seconds. Now :

With the above in mind, and knowing that my disk spindown time is set to 4 minutes *AND* that this always starts to happen after maybe 15-20 minutes (and which sure is about the time I see reported more often), I thought about disk burst processes which reset that 4 minute time versus very small disk I/O which does not reset this time (this is something in the OS); When we additionally see that once the first stops happen they keep on happening throughout the playback session at each track boundary, this burst thing seems related (to me that is).
I still can't reason it out, but I did think of highering that 4 minutes to 7 minutes, and it helped. I have seen no stop since. The tracks I play are usually around that length; often longer.

*What* disk actually needs to spin up (assumed I am right on this part ot begin with) is beyond me. But regarding the all over stall of the system as I can reason out that little part, it has to be the OS disk.

Maybe this helps someone, and when so, the how and what could be important to find this culprit.

Charlie, I know that this doesn't seem to be related to your strange thing, but possibly for you all works out even more strange, thinking of your Vista. So you might try a few things on your disk spindown time.

Peter

[charliemb]

Thanks,  I will check out the spindown time.  I thought that I had no spindown time on any disk.   I'm almost sure they stay on 24/7 if I leave the machine on.

[BvdW]

Peter,

I have been following this thread for a while now, while I have this same stopping problem. I have tried some suggestions from users but nothing works (for me). Whatever settings I try (dev buff. 128 to 4096), SFS from 2 via 2.1, 3.3 up to 60, somewhere halfway a track XX just stops as if I pressed Alt-X and then the GUI comes back (so regard my settings below as 'ideal' as I don't have fixed settings yet).

All depends on the combi of SFS, Q1, xQ1 and device buffer and apparently ones particular PC, as I understand. Is there no possibility to determine the figures for your own PC? As this trial-and-error method of waiting till, for example, track nbr. nine to find out that this new setting also doesn't work, is getting very frustrating (ask my wife )? I even considered to go back to a previous version.

Bert

[PeterSt]

Ok. There has been changed one thing in 0.9z-8-2 in this area, and this is that 22 seconds which is now available for trackload (Unattended) and which always has been 14 seconds (see Release Notes). Since this is for crazy high buffer settings anyway, I will put that back to 14 seconds and then let's see.

Thank you for sharing this Bert. We never should annoy our wives or otherwise we'll lose play time.

Peter

[BvdW]

Thanks, Peter,

You are proposing to use 8.2 as the solution, it seems. Before I download and install it, has the download been modified to 14s in the mean time?
Then, it is a bit of an experimental version, as you say, 'made' for W7 Ultimate. Does this mean I'm a kind of guinea-pig for W7 professional (don't worry, I won't tell my wife...) or did you already receive some experience or feedback from other W7-professional users?

Bert

[PeterSt]

Bert, there is nothing much "experimental" in any version. Or all versions are, also good.

And no, 0.9z-8-2 just *contains* that change which will be undone in the upcoming 0.9z-8-3.

It's all a bit vague and I now realize that while this topic started at January 8 (2013) it can't be about 0.9z-8-2 and not even 8-1. The base 8 version yes.
Conclusion from this ? 0.9z-8-3 won't help you.

I even considered to go back to a previous version.

So, which one would that be ?
Please, try it and let me know whether that definitely doesn't bring you that problem.

Peter