J vs. K version SQ

[LydMekk]

After testing some with both the J and the K version today, I must give a nod towards better SQ from the J version. In comparison the K version sound flatter with much less depth information and generally duller and rounder, unfocused. One of the strengths of J is a VERY good depth recital. I can hear like 10-20m into the sound-picture. Became edgy and disinterested after an hour of playback with K. J makes me relax and really enjoy the music and become involved.

I also hear a lot more air around the performers with J.

Ended up going back to J version and preferring that to the new K.

Using XP and Engine #1, 44.1 output to Lexicon MC-12B DAC/Pro.

Will try out the D version tomorrow and compare it to J.

Impression so far: K was a misstep in evolution as SQ is concerned. J is HighEnd. At least for my platform.

[SeVeReD]

After testing some with both the J and the K version today, I must give a nod towards better SQ from the J version. In comparison the K version sound flatter with much less depth information and generally duller and rounder, unfocused. One of the strengths of J is a VERY good depth recital. I can hear like 10-20m into the sound-picture. Became edgy and disinterested after an hour of playback with K. J makes me relax and really enjoy the music and become involved.

I also hear a lot more air around the performers with J.

Ended up going back to J version and preferring that to the new K.

Using XP and Engine #1, 44.1 output to Lexicon MC-12B DAC/Pro.

Will try out the D version tomorrow and compare it to J.

Impression so far: K was a misstep in evolution as SQ is concerned. J is HighEnd. At least for my platform.

I'm afraid if you like the J version over K, that you probably won't prefer the D version.  Give it a listen though.  To me, J and versions right after D sound striped down down of harmonics/timbre, one reason why they sound so crystal clear and pinpoint imaging.  I'm guessing you've moved the Q1 slider about and tried reversing phase?

[PeterSt]

Uhhmm ... 



... Interesting ...

LydMekk is using XP (no operable Q1 sliders in there) and I really would not know what has changed in there that could have influenced SQ.
But okay, the program *has* changed, so I will try to find it.

LydMekk, thanks.
Peter

[PeterSt]

Btw, are you SURE you did not forget to apply earlier setting which got lost after the 0.9k install ?
For Engine#1 this can be the Sound Device only ... (which may workout as to using different drivers)

[JohanZ]

Hello Peter,

In comparison the K version sound flatter with much less depth information and generally duller and rounder, unfocused. One of the strengths of J is a VERY good depth recital. I can hear like 10-20m into the sound-picture. Became edgy and disinterested after an hour of playback with K. J makes me relax and really enjoy the music and become involved.

Yesterday I had the idee to wrote for sunday mine impression of the 0.9k player. But today I have red the reaction of LydMekk and I recognise his impression. I prefere 0.9j above 0.9k

All instruments has there own role in the music and you can hear them all separately and very clear in the 09j version. The different layers in the sound are very clear and detailled. That gives a great involvement. During listening you can easy switch the focus to another instrument. In the 0.9k version its not asking for attention. It's more a search than a switch for detaills in the music.

I am missing the same impression in the 0.9d version.

I am using Vista engine#3. The Q1 slider is no option for me because I am using a DDDAC1543 that gives small cracks in the music when lowering the Q1 slider. Reversing fase did not change mine impression.

Regards,

Johan

[PeterSt]

But today I have red the reaction of LydMekk and I recognise his impression

Johan, it is totally impossible to compare XP/Engine#1 with Vista/Engine#3. I mean, they are not related at all. But :

By pure coincidence you could perceive the impression you described.
Question : If you replace the XXEngine3.exe in your current folder with the one below in the zip, is everythig back to normal ?

Keep good track of which XXEngine3.exe is which version, because you can't see it. The one to test with (below) is smaller though.

[JohanZ]

Hi Peter,

If you replace the XXEngine3.exe in your current folder with the one below in the zip, is everythig back to normal ?

After some listening this afternoon I still must conclude that I like 0.9j more than the 0.9k version. So the sound isn't back to 'normal'!

The j version shows more depth/space in the sound. k is more flat but also detailled. The sound of a piano *¹ is more warmer, rounder in the k version. In the j version the piano sounds a littlebit more backwards and fresh. By the depth of the j version it sounds that there are more layers in the music.
I have listen to e.g. ¹ Ahmad Jamal "Rossiter Road", Chick Corea "The ultimate Adventures", .......

Regards, Johan

[pedal]

I can testify to LydMekk's findings regarding SQ with XP+Engine1: Version J has better definition of microdynamics, which makes all instruments and voices sound (more) alive. It makes for a more engaging listening experience, without adding any obvious colorations. Version K is more "rounded" and softer in characther. In fact, with K, I can play some tracks 2-3dB louder without listening fatigue, compared with J. (I play very loud, by the way).

But, yes, yes, yes, I have got the captains message to move from XP to VISTA and run engine3, where I will discover an even higher sound quality!

See you in VISTA heaven within a few days!!

PEDAL

[PeterSt]

If you replace the XXEngine3.exe in your current folder with the one below in the zip, is everythig back to normal ?

After some listening this afternoon I still must conclude that I like 0.9j more than the 0.9k version. So the sound isn't back to 'normal'!

The j version shows more depth/space in the sound. k is more flat but also detailled. The sound of a piano *¹ is more warmer, rounder in the k version. In the j version the piano sounds a littlebit more backwards and fresh. By the depth of the j version it sounds that there are more layers in the music.
I have listen to e.g. ¹ Ahmad Jamal "Rossiter Road", Chick Corea "The ultimate Adventures", .......

Johan,

If this did not help (at all ?) I wouldn't know what to do. It should help ...
You could try to start XX from exactly the same folder as the 0.9j version (first save the 0.9j contents to somewhere), by exactly the same means (same desktop icon or whatever you used), and see whether that helps ? I know, this sounds rediculeous, but something must cause it.

Btw, what you describe is not necessarily worse (in 0.9k), and even more flat sound could indicate "better". But that's another story.
Also note that where 0.9k to my ears (so far) is definitely better, 0.9j was doubtful; 0.9d had things 0.9j did not have. 0.9k has things from both, and IMO more (yeah, this "more" is dangerous).

Peter

[PeterSt]

I can testify to LydMekk's findings regarding SQ with XP+Engine1: Version J has better definition of microdynamics, which makes all instruments and voices sound (more) alive. It makes for a more engaging listening experience, without adding any obvious colorations. Version K is more "rounded" and softer in characther. In fact, with K, I can play some tracks 2-3dB louder without listening fatigue, compared with J. (I play very loud, by the way).

But, yes, yes, yes, I have got the captains message to move from XP to VISTA and run engine3, where I will discover an even higher sound quality!

See you in VISTA heaven within a few days!!

PEDAL

pedal,

I sure believe you (even if you would have been alone on this). But I really wonder what you guys do since I did not change a thing. Okay, this is not 100% true, but what I did should not be in an aera that influences sound quality. Also, I thought I had found strange things to influence SQ, but this would beat all.
The point is, this would be beyond my understandings, hence control. Well, today anyway.

For you too, keep in mind that a new version would get rid of earlier settings, and e.g. priority defaults back to "nothing".

In fact, with K, I can play some tracks 2-3dB louder without listening fatigue, compared with J. (I play very loud, by the way).

Yeah, so recognizeable (I play louder, by the way ) so again, I sure believe you (all).
Btw, being able to play less loud for me *always* is an indication of more poor quality. BUT, things must be able to go as loud as you want *including all the detail* (and without standing waves). If you could think 0.9k/XP/Engine#1 is better afterall, my problem would be gone, hehe.

Anyway, I just got an idea of something which could influence SQ. I will apply that in the new 0.9l version (not ready yet).

Peter

[pedal]

Just a short notice to newcomers here at the forum, reading this thread for the first time. My above remarks on the performance of XXHighEnd was valid as long as I was running it on XP. After upgrading to Vista, and using Engine3, the SQ is lifted up to another - and much higher - level. Here we really are speaking about "mastertape-like" sound. So don't waste your time in XP!