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AUDIODIDAKT
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« Reply #15 on: December 30, 2010, 03:34:54 pm » |
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https://www.hdtracks.com/index.php?file=catalogdetail&valbum_code=HD030911111229hdtracks says it a 24/96 (HDCD) ??????????????????? Personally I think this a hdcd upsampled to 24/96 !
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PeterSt
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« Reply #16 on: December 30, 2010, 03:46:20 pm » |
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I can't see that there, but may overlook it. But here it sure says that : http://www.referencerecordings.com/DallasWind.aspEdit : But it's on the cover too. Now, the version I received here for testing, is not an HDCD but 24/96 indeed. So what do we have ... RR itself selling it as HDCD while HD Tracks sells it as 24/96. "My nose" we say in Holland. Edit 2: But the cover also says "24 bit" (HDCD recording) ...  |
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« Reply #17 on: December 30, 2010, 03:49:57 pm » |
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Pedal, try the 16/44 vs 24/96 version of Joao Gilberto and Stan Getz, just curious about your findings I will check it + Gaucho. ----- Gaucho: While the 5.1 mix was done in the optimum way for DVD-A release from the mastertapes, it is rumoured that the stereo version is taken from a Red Book master. The 24/96 layer has a different EQ than my digital remaster CD, that is for sure, but I never performed any measurements/analyzes of it. Downmixing: With the right software, you can perfectly well downmix 5.1 to 2.0. That is what the multiformat players do if the disc doesnt have separate stereo/m-ch layers. I have done it myself. Sometimes with very good result (Dire Straits/Brothers In Arms DualDisc), sometimes with poor result (Doors/LA Woman DVD-A). -The 5.1 layer is tempting because sometimes the tracks are remixed from better sources/closer to the mastertapes. |
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AUDIODIDAKT
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« Reply #18 on: December 30, 2010, 03:59:42 pm » |
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Offcourse equalization in 5.1 is different, you have to half the volume in a 5.1 mix, because.. wel you have more channels. Downmixing: With the right software What software ??? To make a multichannel recording ALL channels are equalized/touched to fit in that 5.1 profile So if you take only Front Left and Front rightout of a 5.1 mix it can NEVER be good, because its equalized (even if they used a better master) Its called LOSSY, not lossless Ask yourself then: why would they put mostly a seperate 2.0 in there ??? Its all filtered, filtered, filtered......................... We know why NOS1 is great right !? |
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PeterSt
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« Reply #19 on: December 30, 2010, 04:06:37 pm » |
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I hope the last time about the Dallas Wind album ...
I think it says nothing that "24 bit" is mentioned together with HDCD. That happens all the time.
What I also recall -and I just looked again- that the Liner Notes contain exactly nothing about 24/96 - and btw also nothing about HDCD. This by itself would be nothing special for Keith Johnson who was behind the wheels here (doing HDCD all the time).
Maybe the fact that "2007" is the production year says something. I mean, without it being a DVD-A (or SACD) I can't imagine that we were up to HD downloads back then. I know, it's one 3.5 years back, but still.
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« Reply #20 on: December 30, 2010, 04:07:41 pm » |
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I think you are a little pesimistic, Roy! It is a 2007 recording from Reference Recordings, made with some of the best equipment there is. It is recorded in 24/176.4 with the very same Pacific Microsonics Model 2 AD/DA as Mani has. For sale as: -CD with HDCD decoding. -24/96 download. -It is even available as HRx, which is a pure 1:1 copy of the digital master, in 24/176.4. LINK: http://www.russandrews.com/product-HRx:-Crown-Imperial--Dallas-Wind-Symphony-7624.htm |
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PeterSt
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« Reply #21 on: December 30, 2010, 04:10:58 pm » |
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I must concur with Roy;
He spend a week without sleep on downmixing from left to right, bottom to up, back to forth, inside to out, and it just never works (I tested it all myself).
Unless ..
Unless he didn't find the right software. But I guess we can trust Roy a little on this.
One small remark : I think that all ended with me saying that some meta data may exist on *how* to downmix (or that I read about the existance of it). This may mean that a DVD player can do it, while "we" never found / created software for that.
But without this information it is IMPOSSIBLE. Just like Roy said (and include the remark that 5.1 recordings are mixed specially in the first place, like Pedal said I think).
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AUDIODIDAKT
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« Reply #22 on: December 30, 2010, 04:13:31 pm » |
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I'am just talking about the "Geniune" 24/96 from HD-Tracks !
The same as Boleary has......
I'am familiair with the wind series from reference recordings, hell, almost bought them all (Peter?)
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PeterSt
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« Reply #23 on: December 30, 2010, 04:14:04 pm » |
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Hahaha Pedal, good one !!
To me this tells nothing more than that someone gave himself the opportunity to downres it from there thinking it will be better.
About Keith ... I just said it, so nothing wrong there.
Don't forget ... it sounds like sh*t.
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A: W-Y-R-G, B: *W-G* USB 1m00 -> Phisolator 24/768 Phasure NOS1a/G3 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (16ms) -> B'ASS Current Amplifier -> Blaxius*^2.5* A:B-G, B:B-G Interlink -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers. ET^2 Ethernet from Mach III to Music Server PC (RDC Control).
Removed Switching Supplies from everywhere (also from the PC).
For a general PC :
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*XXHighEnd PC -> I7 3930k with Hyperthreading On (12 cores)* @~500MHz, 16GB, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit build 10586.0 from RAM, music on LAN / Engine#4 Adaptive Mode / Q1/-/3/4/5 = 14/-/1/1/1 / Q1Factor = 1 / Dev.Buffer = 4096 / ClockRes = 1ms / Memory = Straight Contiguous / Include Garbage Collect / SFS = 0.10 (max 60) / not Invert / Phase Alignment Off / Playerprio = Low / ThreadPrio = Realtime / Scheme = Core 3-5 / Not Switch Processors during Playback = Off/ Playback Drive none (see OS from RAM) / UnAttended (Just Start) / Always Copy to XX Drive (see OS from RAM) / All Services Off / Keep LAN - Not Persist / WallPaper On / OSD On / Running Time Off / Minimize OS / XTweaks : Balanced Load = *43* / Nervous Rate = 1 / Cool when Idle = 1 / Provide Stable Power = 1 / Utilize Cores always = 1 / Time Performance Index = *Optimal* / Time Stability = *Stable* / Custom Filter *Low* 705600 / -> USB3 *from MoBo* -> Clairixa USB 15cm -> Intona Isolator -> Clairixa USB 1m80 -> 24/768 Phasure NOS1a 75B (BNC Out) async USB DAC, Driver v1.0.4b (4ms) -> Blaxius BNC interlink *-> B'ASS Current Amplifier /w Level4 -> Blaxius Interlink* -> Orelo MKII Active Open Baffle Horn Speakers.
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manisandher
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« Reply #24 on: December 30, 2010, 04:14:30 pm » |
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hdtracks says it a 24/96 (HDCD) ???????????????????
Personally I think this a hdcd upsampled to 24/96 !
Now, the version I received here for testing, is not an HDCD but 24/96 indeed. So what do we have ... RR itself selling it as HDCD while HD Tracks sells it as 24/96. "My nose" we say in Holland. Edit 2: But the cover also says "24 bit" (HDCD recording) ... Careful here guys. You can have a 24/96 or a 24/176.4 that has the HDCD flag in it. Of course, such files will not use any of the HDCD processes like 'Peak Extend', but the HDCD flag can still be there. Is it then legitimate to call it a '24/96 HDCD' or '24/176.4 HDCD'? I don't know and I really don't have a strong view on this. But one thing I do know is that if the HDCD flag is there on the HDTracks 24/96, then it has definitely been created using an HDCD encoder - there is absolutely no other way of imbedding the HDCD flag. Of course, the file could have been created by downsampling from 24/176.4, digitizing directly from analogue at 24/96... or upsampling from 16/44.1. If I had to guess, I'd say that it's probably been downsampled from 24/176.4. If it has the HDCD flag, then this would have been done 'properly' with an HDCD encoder. Mani. |
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pedal
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« Reply #25 on: December 30, 2010, 04:15:28 pm » |
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What software ???
To make a multichannel recording ALL channels are equalized/touched to fit in that 5.1 profile
So if you take only Front Left and Front rightout of a 5.1 mix it can NEVER be good, because its equalized (even if they used a better master)
Its called LOSSY, not lossless
Ask yourself then: why would they put mostly a seperate 2.0 in there ???
Its all filtered, filtered, filtered......................... Roy, hold your horses! It seems you are not updated on these matters... You can get an idea about it in this thread: http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t44593.htmlMy initial attempts have been with DVD Audio Extractor. Recently I purchased the Adobe Audition 3.0 where I can tailor the mix myself. |
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« Reply #26 on: December 30, 2010, 04:22:43 pm » |
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General observation about HD Tracks: Since they only sell you the file, there is obviously no "physical" product. No plastic case, no book, no leaflet.
Consequently, the pdf cover art they give you together with the flac files is sometimes taken from the CD issue or from the SACD issue. So you shouldn't read it like the devil reads the bible...
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AUDIODIDAKT
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« Reply #27 on: December 30, 2010, 04:25:38 pm » |
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Recently I purchased the Adobe Audition 3.0 where I can tailor the mix myself. Its still called lossy. |
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AUDIODIDAKT
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« Reply #29 on: December 30, 2010, 05:02:23 pm » |
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Steely Dan - Gaucho
But Pedal did you compared those to the normal 16/44 version or the mfsl version. (with ARC)
I can send them to you, for testing purpose
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(Sept 30, 2010)
W7 Ultimate x64 Tweaked/60 GB SSD OCZ Vertex (1.50)/Gigabyte GA-EP45-EXTREME/Intel Q9550 2.83Ghz/OZC Reaper 2x2GB/
Esi Juli@ soundcard (KS)(x2v-v0_978)(Tweaked Coaxial)/Nvidea Geforce 9800 GTX+/750 Watt Zalman ZM-750-HP/100 MB Fiber-Optical Internet/
(XXHighEnd 0.9z-2)
#4Engine, Special Mode, 48 samples, SFS 12MB, DAP, Scheme=3, Q1=1, Q2/Q3/Q4/Q5=30,30,0,0, PlayerPrio=Low, ThreadPrio=Realtime
x-Allow Format Change, x-Stop Services, x-Copy to XX-drive by Standard, x-Start Engine3 During Conversion
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