Build a new computer for Z3/Vista 64 bit/RAMdisk

[Suteetat]

For those suggesting bench-type cases, all depends where you keep the PC. The EMI And RFI generated by the pc are shielded by aluminium* and other metals. An open case has only one way where the radiations can go, while with a completely open one, they can go anywhere

(*mu-metal is the best, aluminium is the de facto standard and other cheeper metals shield less but still shield!)

Hmmm, I did not think of EMI, RFI stuff. So look like closed case will have to do as my computer is placed right next to my DAC and the rest of the stereo system.
Zalman fanless case is not available over here as far as I know and it looks way too involving for me to try to mug around with it myself
At least I will be sitting 4-5m away from it in a relatively large room. When I play music, I can't actually hear the fans anyhow from my current computer.
Just hope that the fans won't add too much of the other noise if I have one or two of those running.

[Telstar]

Just hope that the fans won't add too much of the other noise if I have one or two of those running.

The noise raises exponentially with the number of fans that are working at the same time.
2 quiet fans (one for case and one for cpu) should be all that is needed for a music-playing computer with current components.

[PeterSt]

Although I used 2003 server (which is basically vista kernel), I would not recommend it nowadays. It's too outdated and the drivers are a pita to find.

I guess this "vista" is a typo and should be XP ?

[Suteetat]

An interesting development! I just heard that Playback Design MPS-5 that I am using is going get an upgrade USB module (or something) early next year that will
accept at least up to 384 kHz which I assume meaning that I could play 16/44.1 kHz file with 8x AP or perhaps playing those handful
DXD recordings (24/352.8 kHz) that are available. Just to make sure that I I have everything ready, I am not sure how much RAM I would
need for something like this. Currently I am leaning toward 12GB triple channel DDR3. Is that going to be enough for playing say, one single album?
On 2L site, I see that a typical DXD track is anywhere from 500mb (3-4 minutes)-1.1GB (almost 10 minutes). If I have 10GB RAMdisk, would I be able
to play, let say 8 of those 1.1 GB tracks theoretically without any problem. Also would 2GB only assign to RAM be enough?

[Telstar]

Although I used 2003 server (which is basically vista kernel), I would not recommend it nowadays. It's too outdated and the drivers are a pita to find.

I guess this "vista" is a typo and should be XP ?

No, it's not a typo. 2003 server kernel was the base for Vista's one.

[Suteetat]

Hmmm, I might have to rethink the minimal fan a bit more
I installed Intel i7 950 on Gigabyte X58A-UD7 rev 2, 12GB DDR3 tripple channel.
So trying to use the least number of fans, I use Thermalright HR-02 fanless CPU heatsink
in a full tower Lian Li case with 2x 12cm fans front and back and Seasonic X-series 750W and a nice and cheap ATI graphic card with no fan,
At 3.06 GHz, unfortunately CPU temp went from 37C up to 48-50C during Vista installation. Room temp is around 25-26C
I took the CPU speed down to 2.4 Gz and temp dropped to around 44C. I think I leave everything as is for now but
look like ultimately, I might not be able to avoid fan on CPU heatsink I did get a 14cm 1200 RPM fan just in case.

[Marcin_gps]

LOL, you think that's high? If you had 70-80 degrees, then you could worry about temperature. Intel can operate with temperatatures up to 95 degrees.

[xp9433]

From Audioasylum  http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/pcaudio/messages/8/81264.html

I think there are different "64 bit" things going on, not to be confused:

1. The precision used in the DSP calculations (e.g. filters). Here 64 bit floating point is essential because it provides the needed 48 bits of resolution to reduce round-off errors in the complex calculations,

2. The precision used in audio file formats (e.g. 24 bit fixed point, 32 bit floating point). Some software uses 64 bit internal calculations but "bounces" the final data to 32 bits before going into a file,

3. The address size used in CPU instructions, e.g. 32 bits in length or 64 bits in length. You will need a 64 bit processor to directly address more than 4 GB of RAM memory.

It is possible to use 64 bit calculations and 64 bit file formats in with a 32 bit processor and operating system. Indeed, the 32 bit processors will also do 64 bit calculations. It's only if you have very memory intensive applications that there is much to be gained by going to a 64 bit system, and the extra size of instructions is likely to actually reduce performance unless the extra memory capability is exploited. I run the 64 bit iZotope SRC in Soundforge Pro 10, and here it will support both 32 bit and 64 bit floating point. The (slightly newer) version in iZotope RX Advanced uses 64 bit calculations, but doesn't support the 64 bit floating point in the file format. A further confusing factor is that the WAV file format itself is limited to 32 bit addressing in the file (4 GB) if the standard Microsoft WAV format is used. (There are variants that allow for extended addressing.)

Tony Lauck

 The references to needing a "64 bit processor to directly address more than 4 GB of RAM", and, "WAV file format being limited to 32 bit addressing in the file" were interesting.
Whether this has any relevance to structuring a new computer I don't know.

[Telstar]

LOL, you think that's high? If you had 70-80 degrees, then you could worry about temperature. Intel can operate with temperatatures up to 95 degrees.

I agree to a certain point. What matters is that the PC is 100% stable when playing music.
Mine is with an average temp of 45-55°C depending on season. But if I do some stress test it crashes. I accept this for the pleasure of having zero noise.

[PeterSt]

The references to needing a "64 bit processor to directly address more than 4 GB of RAM", and, "WAV file format being limited to 32 bit addressing in the file" were interesting.
Whether this has any relevance to structuring a new computer I don't know.

Thank you Frank.
Also, I never saw one reason to not concider Tony's posts as good information.

Peter


PS: The relevance of one WAV file not being able to be larger than 4 GB is small; I didn't do the math, but I think even a 60 minute 32/192 will fit into that. Maybe just not though.

[Suteetat]

LOL, you think that's high? If you had 70-80 degrees, then you could worry about temperature. Intel can operate with temperatatures up to 95 degrees.

One concern I had was that during Vista installation, the computer crashed after it reboot. I have no idea if that was from instability due to heat or not. After  reboot, similar thing happened again so after rebooting again, I reduced the CPU speed and temp came down a bit and there was no problem with that.
I have no way of verifying if it was really the temp or not but thought I mentioned it here. Since there seems to be a few people thinking of building a new computer, it was worth mentioning.

[ivo]

Hello to all,

I am also planning to build up a 100% fanless really dedicated music box. As I am more or less knowledgeable in this field my dream setup would look like this:

MOBO: with PS/2 ports for mouse and keys, built-in graphic card, 4 slots for mem allowing to go at least 8 GB
CPU: multi-core, need to find the sweet spot among speed and heat as I am going to use it naked (without fan, just the radiator)
PSU: fanless
HDD: SSD 32 GB for heavily vlited Windows Vista x64
Screen: 15"-17" inch LCD to control playback[/li][/list]
Audio: HiFace MK2 USB-SPDIF adapter
DAC: external one

Music files will be located on external USB drive, BTW USB drive nicely spins down when XX plays music from RamDisk, so no added load on USB bus.

BTW2, if you guys still use fans (i do so now also) a nice utility called SpeedFan helps managing the fans the way you like it. What I do, is I switch off fan control in BIOS and then do control fans via SpeedFan. For example, I turn off CPU fan and Sys Fan and configure the utility so, that it turns on those fans only in case some component heats up, that really makes the system silent. Actually, my E6300 C2D never needs CPU fan to be run.

Ivo

[Chriss]

Ivo
that's the way! Here a nice PSU:
Thermaltake Fanless Purepower 350 Model W0029 — 350W ATX power supply.
Your E6300 CPU is a very very good choice I will take E7300:
"For affordable performance per watt, there's no going past the Intel Core 2 Duo processors. A good choice for this sort of project is the E7300. It has enough grunt to spare that you can underclock it, and lower the core voltage to run it cooler. Put a passive cooler on it, you want to avoid fans, they're noisy both acoustically and electrically."
Regards, Criss.

[ivo]

Thanks Chriss!!!

[ivo]

BTW, I just thought about non-moving parts in audio design....
take the CD players, the only things that moves there is CD and the lens, so by designing a completely static pc-based audio (ok, there will be the USB drive spinning but it will spin down after minutes) we move at least one step ahead which is I guess great.

I still vote for total fanless and moveless design!

Ivo

p.s. The ideal setup = where only speakers move inside the cabinet