Thanks and Sound Quality

[juanpmar]

Ok, now I understand, I can use any of the KS modes: Normal, Special or Adaptive, but with all of them my Engine is just #3, nothing about #4Engine. I use lately Adaptive mode.

[AUDIODIDAKT]

Hi juanpmar,

You can only use adaptive and special mode with KS !?

#3Engine is also #4Engine, so in both cases ks or wasapi, #3Engine is running.

if you doubt you could make a screenshot of your xx settings and post it.

Roy

PS: and welcome to the scene !

[juanpmar]

Hi Audiodidakt,
 
Thanks so much for your help, I wasn´t looking at the complete list of KS devices and yes there is one with KS prefixed. Now I can play with #4Engine. Too many things to look at with this player...ok, the sound makes it worthwhile.

Just a couple of questions:

- How can I see the buffer size in my device?. My Musiland Monitor USD has a window that says ASIO Buffer with 5, 10, 20, 40, 80 and 160 values. If I make a x 100 of these values I get close to the numbers in the Buffer size of the XXHighEnd; as an example 2000 is close to 2048. Is that correct?.
I´m using Adaptive Mode and Q1:1 and when I change the buffer size I can´t tell differences between 2048 and 1024. What should be the differences between higher or lower values

- I can play the music using a preamp or directly with the XXHigEnd. I read in some place that using the Volume affect the sound, in that case would be better to use a preamp, I guess.

Btw, how do you make the screen shots?

[AUDIODIDAKT]

Hey juanpmar,

Hi Audiodidakt,
 
Thanks so much for your help, I wasn´t looking at the complete list of KS devices and yes there is one with KS prefixed. Now I can play with #4Engine. Too many things to look at with this player...ok, the sound makes it worthwhile.

#4Engine (KS) should be better sounding as #3Engine (WASAPI), you have to work out for yourself if you prefer "special" or "adaptive" mode
Special mode is made for low latency playback, which suite me well, for electronic music.
Adaptive mode is more suitable for other music, I guess, higher latency is preferred, like 1024, 2048 samples

Just a couple of questions:

- How can I see the buffer size in my device?. My Musiland Monitor USD has a window that says ASIO Buffer with 5, 10, 20, 40, 80 and 160 values. If I make a x 100 of these values I get close to the numbers in the Buffer size of the XXHighEnd; as an example 2000 is close to 2048. Is that correct?.
I´m using Adaptive Mode and Q1:1 and when I change the buffer size I can´t tell differences between 2048 and 1024. What should be the differences between higher or lower values

ASIO is for WASAPI, so not for kernel streaming you are using with #4Engine.
I imagine Peter is bit busy today, he will get back on the "Musiland Monitor", which I know nothing about.

- I can play the music using a preamp or directly with the XXHigEnd. I read in some place that using the Volume affect the sound, in that case would be better to use a preamp, I guess.

Well its better to not use a pre-amp at all, the volume control in xx software is currently the best option available.
BUT, its can be a bit tedious to work with (getting use to).
Hold your horses on taking the pre-amp out of the chain, aproach this with caution.

Btw, how do you make the screen shots?

In vista, you can use the button "PrtScn" on your upper-right-side of the keyboard, open windows paint then use the paste option in paint.
In W7, you have a nice tool called "Snipping Tool"


Best Regards,

Roy

[Tony S]

Hello juanpmar,

I use the Musiland Monitor 02USD and I have my buffer setting at 1024 which sounds best to me. I like using Adaptive mode with Q1=1 and Q2 and Q3 between 15 and 30 depending on what I am listening too and sometimes Q2 and Q3 is best at zero. I have been experimenting with the SFS setting a little bit and 95 seems to work well and if I start going below 95 I start to lose my bass but really haven't had time experimenting with those settings.

I have been using Scott Endler's passive attenuators for volume control which work well but usually set them at full volume once the amp has warmed-up and use the volume control on XXHighend since it is kind of a pain reaching behind the amp to change the volume. The attenuators do take away from the sound a bit even for a couple of resistors in the signal path. I have run direct from the dac to the amp which sounds great but afraid of some stray noise from Windows blasting through my speakers.

If you have any more questions about the Musiland let me know and I'll try to help out.

Tony

[juanpmar]

Thanks Roy and Tony.

Yes, maybe using the XX volume makes a difference but I agree that must be used with care.

My problem now is if I´m using Wasapi or Asio. The Musiland comes with Asio drivers but it seems that the KS mode is made for Wasapi. Can anyone help to let me know how to use Wasapi with my Musiland?

Thanks, Juan

[AUDIODIDAKT]

I think if xx is set to KS mode (see my pic above KS: Juli@ .......) it should play in KS mode, meaning you have sound.

In that same pic you can see the "device buffer size", use that for changing your driver latency.
I dont know if that overrules your normal Musiland setting.

Dont mix up the KS and Wasapi (-ASIO)

Wasapi is what you had first with #3Engine, KS is what should be used for #4Engine !

[juanpmar]

Ok, the Device I´m using as appear in the litle window is:  KS: Monitor 01 USD [0001] >> #wave and yes, there is sound. If I understand well you Roy, do you mean that if I have sound with the KS mode I don´t have to be aware about Wasapi or Asio?

[AUDIODIDAKT]

Ok, the Device I´m using as appear in the litle window is:  KS: Monitor 01 USD [0001] >> #wave and yes, there is sound. If I understand well you Roy, do you mean that if I have sound with the KS mode I don´t have to be aware about Wasapi or Asio?

Good,

ASIO only runs on WASAPI, you don't use WASAPI for #4Engine so, only focus on Kernell Streaming (KS)

Try some music now, you can still switch between WASAPI (-ASIO) and KS.
And what are your findings ?

Common rules in KS are (user findings):

Adaptive mode @ 1024 or 2048 (4096)
Special mode  @ 48

You can also look for settings in Tony S his signature,
 

[juanpmar]

Yes, I can change between Interfaz SPDIF (4- MUSILAND Monitor 01 USD) and KS: Monitor 01 USD [0001] >> #wave  and automatically change the #3Engine to #4Engine with a change in sound that I have to analyse with more time.

I´ll apply the rules you mentioned to see what happens and post my findings. So far I´m using Adaptive Mode/@2048/Split fs 43.

I´ll check also the Tony settings as he uses Musiland also.

[juanpmar]

Tony, as we both have the Musiland interface I´ve checked your settings and a quick impression is that there is no big difference between 1024 and 2048 but maybe a bit better with 1024.

With the other settings: Q1:1 and Q2-Q3:15-30 and I´ve found the sound a little sibilant. For me looks more natural with Q1:1 and other Qs at 0. Also the fx 2 makes the sound in my system a little brighter. I have to check it with more time though.

SFS setting was 43 with #3Engine, now I have to experiment because #4Engine seems a little dryer. Maybe just 45 would be ok, it´s quite impressive how a number or two more can make a difference.

Would be interesting if other people with Musiland inform on their findings.

[Tony S]

Juanpmar, In my Musiland control panel I have ASIO shut off and I'm using the WDM volume control for the Engine 4 setting. I usually set that to 100%, the Analog slider to 100% or the Digital slider to 100% for SPDIF output when using the Ack Dack and control the volume within XXHighEnd.

Under the Advanced tab in the Musiland control panel I have the SR control set to precision. There have been a few software upgrades with the Musiland and I'm not sure which version you are using but the lastest and I feel the best is the 1.0.10.0. version which I believe came out in July.
I don't use the MU-Bass control.

I few times I have set the SFS to anything below 90 the upper midrange and treble tends to be a bit bright and in your face than I like. I only had brief period to try different SFS settings. I really need a full day of listening to get a better idea of what settings work best. Maybe if I use higher Q settings than I could experiment with lower SFS, not sure yet.

The Q2-3 settings that I have been using in the past can vary depending on what artist I'm am listening too. If some of the music is bass heavy I keep the settings at zero but some earlier recordings with not much gain, I find 15-30 helps give them a little more warmth. There is so much difference from one recording to another which can make it tough to find an ideal setting for me anyway. With those settings, at the time, I had the SFS set at 110.

Hope this helps.

[juanpmar]

Thanks Tony. While XX is playing I turned the Asio on and off and the sound doesn´t change at all. As Audiodidact (Roy) said when you use KS mode there is no use of Asio or Wasapi.

The last discovery I´ve made is to look for the Buffer Size as the Help in the XX says. I´ve found that my Buffer Size is 512 and that makes a big difference on sound when using Adaptive mode that requires exact buffer size. Try the correct Buffer size first, if you don´t have looked for it yet, and later look for the SFS because 90 and upper seems TOO rich for me, although of course it depends on your system. I´m using SFS at 43 and until I found the correct Buffer size the sound was on the bright size but not with the 512Mb setting, now the sound is much more natural.

I´ve played for a while with the Qs but I´ve found that the less distortion is with the typical Q1: 1 and the rest to 0.

[PeterSt]

A small remark from my side :

ASIO is as different as Kernel Streaming and WASAPI. What the three have in common is that they allow "but perfect" playback.
ASIO is not supported by XXHighEnd, and thus any ASIO buffers won't do a thing (I never made it, because I don't like the sound coming from ASIO, which again has its own character).

Roy may have referred to something like ASIO4ALL which is an ASIO emulator for devices which don't support ASIO. So, ASIO is indeed to be supported by the device (Pro devices always do).

Peter

[simpsimon]

Hi Peter, just upgraded to z-3 and have a problem.  Every time I go to play a song I get the message "XXEngine3.exe has stopped working".  Any idea as to what I may be doing wrong?  I've uninstalled and reinstalled, rebooted etc and get the same message.

Thanks,
Bill Saimond